Henseleit-Helicopters TDR

Hello to all modelers of this community.I am new here on this forum and this is my first post.
My name is Davor and I am from Serbia.I am interesting for helicopters as well as for airplanes.
I started this thread to ask about Your opinions about Henseleit-Helicopters TDR because it has been manufactured in Germany and maybe some of you guys have it.I was thinking between this one and Kasama Srimok 90E,so feedback and comparation this two are welcome.
Thanks

Davor

Upss,I have just realised that I posted thread in wrong section.In nitro heli insted in electric.My apologize I dont speak german and google translate confused me.
Asking moderators to move topic in electric section please.

Thanks

Dear brcicd,
I have a TDR and I can just say that I loved building that machine! It flies superb and has a great sound !!
The only negative aspect is the time you need to wait until you get one....don't know if you are patient enough....
In these days where one can buy anything with one click and get it shipped next day, it's kind of exciting to wait and wait and wait.....once you get it you'm be the happiest person ! Promise !!

I can say anything about the Kasama but it's slightly too much blimg bling for me - I better like Minicopter Joker or Ploechingers Acrobat Shark or Voodoo instead !
Just my 2 cents
MarkusD

Hi Davor,

your question here is leading to the thought, that you didn't discover the RCN electric helicopters section at all, because about 99 % of the threads in the last few months are dealing with the TDR.

This is because a kind of a scene of a couple of TDR-pilots hanging around here. All of them (I know) are more than satisfied with this bird, which is again (like all the former Henseleit constuctions) a little different compared to all the others. It's all about design (which is very special and reduced to the minimum of needed mechanical components) and the conception of the powerfull electric engine together the FBL - construction.

In this RCN - scene it is also very common to use custom built Scorpion engines, which developement was mainly driven by Ralph Okon together with Scorpion, so that every opinion, which will come to your request will be more or less "mainstream".

You won't find somebody here, who is able to judge a Kasama Srimok in comparison to a TDR, because if you have a TDR (in addition with such a "funny" Scorpion) you don't think about any other Heli in this 700 class. But this is just a reasonable guess. Probably somebody has/had a Srimok (for ME just a boring pretty old fashioned american style designed machine).

The only problem with the TDR is to get one if you don't want to wait over month for it.

Ingo

I believe you will not find too much Kasama-helicopters around here (Germany) yet.
Until now must people didn't notice it at all I think.
This is now (I think within the comming flying-season) changing.

BUT: I think RC-Network isn't really the best information-platform for a question like this, because here are not enough pilots and the used materials are more or less "similar" on the most TDRs...

The TDR is in Germany pretty well known, because Henseleit does for some years constructions which are a little bit different to standard helis. This is also why the "hype" around this heli (is this an german word or is it in same use in english? I'm not quite sure...) is that big.

As already said: There are some more helis in this class. Please also don't forget the "Shape" (also "german engineering"), Rave 90 / 700 and the Avant Aurora.....

I think delivery shouldn't be a big problem for all producers.

Alex

AAAB507 schrieb:

BUT: I think RC-Network isn't really the best information-platform for a question like this, because here are not enough pilots and the used materials are more or less "similar" on the most TDRs...

Zum Vergrößern anklicken....

....ahaaa.....

I think for questions about the TDR Henseleit, this is a very good informationplatform here.

Mike

Hello guys,
Thanks for replying on my question,appreciate.
I still have a small difficulties useing this forum,normally because language,so I apologies for inconvenience.

MarkusD:
More or less I had informations that TDR is realy good quality heli.I am member of HeliFreak and people saying good things,but considering that heli has been made in Germany best opinion can give me German modelers community :-).I am glad you are satisfied with yours.

Arnie91:
"your question here is leading to the thought, that you didn't discover the RCN electric helicopters section at all, because about 99 % of the threads in the last few months are dealing with the TDR..."
I know what you meen but somehow I managed to miss electric section.My bad,but google translate messes me a lot sometime.As you can see I made post in nitro section and then...surprise,surprise there is electric section with ton posts about TDR :-)!!

I sow something about custom built Scorpion engines and Kontronik Jive 120,but then again I have to read it very carefully to understand,like I said google translate.
I like simplicity fact,and reduceing number of parts.
I would ask about Kontronik motor if that would be good choice for TDR and 90 size helis?
One more thing,on Henseleit site I could not find price for TDR kit,only that waiting list is realy big?

AAAB507:
Thanks for opinion.But I have to say that I am not familiar with "Shape" model (dont blame me) .About Avant Aurora and Rave,yes those are great helis just I am not sure about spare parts supply.

Thanks again

Davor

Hi Davor,

the kit price for a TDR is 980 Euros. Kontronik motors work well, so do Scorpions and others.

Regards,
Simon.

Hi Davor,

yes the google translator is a really funny thing
But you seem to be quite familiar with English so we at least here can go ahead beside googles "help".

I can remember, that it's not that easy to find the price for the TDR on Jans HP.
You can't find and buy it in his shop system, so you need to send an eMail to get a place on the waitlist.

The TDR first release in 09 came with a price of 888,- € for the naked mechanics. The first testings on a wide customer range with the first 300 Helis came to the result, that there are some points to enhance the TDR in Jans opinion.

So first he developed a counter bearing for the proposed Kontronik pyro engine, which is build around a rather weak 6mm shaft.

The second release of the TDR this year got a new head, which is a little more complicated and was supposed to avoid shaking of the Heli on low RPMs.
In addition Jan changed the gears and some other details for the tailrotor to higher quality combinations, which allows now to run more than 2000 RPMs without any problems at the tail. It also reduces the noise level to an absolute whistler.

All these things (the counter bearing now is part of the kit) increased the price to a still very compatitive 980,- €.

The delivery time is something around 6-9 month or you try to catch a used one on EBAY or the private sells of the different communities. In most of those cases the seller determines the prices on rather ridiculous levels, because of the long waiting list. So be carefull then.

The spare parts should reach Serbia in a reasonable time (There are TDRs all over the world)

Your question regarding the engine: You could buy a Kontronik, but these engines are underdogs compared to some of the scorpions regarding mechanical rigidity and power. To keep it more simple: A comparable factory Scorpion is about 100,- € less in price. If you spend the necessary money for a pyro on a special Scorpion (for instance the already sold out 4525 520 LE ) you have a lot superior engine compared to any other available Pyro (if you don't mention the black edition pyros on it's unbelievable price ).

Regards

Ingo

Hi Ingo,
This post was very helpful and extensive.Thanks appreciate.

I can tell you I am very interesting for TDR.Now I have to figured out how to convert all my fleet to electric (considering TDR is electric) :-) because I have trex 500 and two nitro Trex 700 and Compass Knight 3D (not assembled yet).I have been thinking about that for long time especially because I am planing to buy airplane (50cc size) and to convert it to electric so I can use battery for all aircrafts.
Small off topic ;-).I did not know that Scorpion motors,especially model 4525 520 LE,seems to be better choice then Kontronik pyro considering that community here are more for Scorpion.Useful knowledge :-)

Davor

Hi Davor,

you can still take my statement about the engines more or less as an independant experience, because I also started with the pyro 30-12 and converted after a couple of hundred flights to the Scorpions.

And this is what the majority of all the TDR - pilots here also did. And again also here you won't find somebody who's unsatisfied with these engines, or even would think about to mount a Kontronik instead again. And btw. :The scorpions don't need the counterbearing at all

There are for sure also some other alternatives for the TDR at the engines place, but I personally can't state that out. I never tried others and I won't.

Regards

Ingo

arnie91 schrieb:

And this is what the majority of all the TDR - pilots here also...

Zum Vergrößern anklicken....

That's what I was talking about.
But how many pilots are "here"? - Could maybe someone count??

I don't want to say, this one is better or not equal to the other one. I just want to remark, there are a lot more TDRs flying than opinions found in RC-N...
There are even cheaper motors (Xera) that seem to do their work.
It's also about your flight skills and how much "power" you wish & need.
3D-Flight doesn't need that much power if you can really fly (what I saw and got to notice).
Heli-Speed-Flights do need as much power as you can get (as far as I know)...

http://www.shape-helicopters.de/

Greetings,

Alex

But how many pilots are "here"? - Could maybe someone count??

Zum Vergrößern anklicken....

Beside the fact, that tihs really doesn't matter, I know about 10 guys personally without searching to hard in the backside of my mind.

Why is it so hard to understand, that there could be a bunch of people, who are totally convinced and satisfied with one type of Heli. Davor was asking for opinions for the TDR or the Kasama Srimok. He got mine about the TDR and I'm not really afraid to specify what I would prefer or not on my personal experience. Not more, not less. Why the hell are people always talking about a "hype". There are more than 700 TDRs delivered (in my knowlegde) and I would guess, that more than 95% of the owners are totally happy without a tense of any hype. The damned thing was sold that much because it's simply a rather good construction with pretty nice flying characteristics. If somebody is looking for a speed machine, he will take most of the time a TDR because of the good aerodynamics.

The same guy can do a lot of 3D stuff without changing to many things at the setup. (mainly mount different mainblades)

The engine for me must be a good compromise and hellmonsters like a 4535 really do make sense in a speed setup and is not necessary in a 3D - machine. But there's for sure no situation where you would think: O damned I do have too much power and torque in my Heli. I don't want to have it.
And I think it wasn't a too brave guess, that all the TDR - users here won't do the change to any other type of engine than a Scorpion. Probably everybody here is a little bit strange, but a group of at least 10 people are more representive than the overall count of the mentinioned Shape helicopter owners. I didn't recognize too many building threads of delivered machines yet. If you'd like to tell something about a hype, than do it for this machine.

If you read the threads about it, you could get the impression, that nothing better is exsisting in the galaxy without having any experience with it in flying. It might be also a good 90 size Heli, but there are some negative issues on it. First the price, and second the short history of this company (I don't know if you can call it a company already). And again the design doesn't touch me at all. I don't like the canopy and the rest doesn't impress me too much. It seems also not that lightweight as promoted. I never would do a statement like it is a better or worse machine than a TDR, because I don't have one. I only stated the reasons why this also won't change in the future.

Again and last try: THIS is MY opinion and I don't know how to say it clearer than this.

Regards

Ingo

Hi Davor,
If you consider that you already own some helicopters with decent size, you should place the order with Jan.....waiting has never been more nice and funny!!
I consider myself as sports/acrobatic flyer and run the machine with the suggested set-up (pyro,bls451;251;miniVbar;jive 80hv) without any regrets....

I guess that most guys over here in this forum are close to Scorpion / Powercroco (Dr Okon)....that's probably the reason for their favour. No doubt that scorpion offers the best value for the price! At the time of my decision, Jan was still worried about the heat generated by Scorpion motors...but this is all past now! Georges van Ganse (the guy behind Scorpion) has a TDR, too. You may find him on RunRyder etc.

If you want to test fly a TDR and you are sometimes in Germay, I suggest to book some flight in Bernd Poetings flight school ( www.poeting1.de ). He is located near cologne (approx. 1h drive) and teaches all year......

In other german forum communities, you will also find people with Plettenberg Copter 30 motors....but as stated already: you need to know what you want to fly !

Hope this will help!
BR,
MarkusD

Hey Davor,

did you see this one:

http://rc-network.de/forum/showthread.php?t=237889

BR,
MarkusD

arnie91 schrieb:

Why is it so hard to understand, that there could be a bunch of people, who are totally convinced and satisfied with one type of Heli.

Zum Vergrößern anklicken....

It's not hard to understand at all.
But he wanted to get an overview about the differences, etc. (so I did understand his question), and this is why I said, he won't find to much different set-ups (not to talk about the Srimok) around RC-N...

The Shape is just another 90-size heli. And as Kasama, Henseleit, Plöchinger, Youngblood, etc are all pretty small producers. But the Shape-guys are very new on the market, that's right.
If you really want to have good supply of parts, you need to buy an Align or an Mikado. Last ones are prefered by most of the 3d-guys, maybe just because of this fact.

Alex

I hope you guys dont mind because my delay in answering I was busy in last few days.

MarkusD:

"Hey Davor,

did you see this one:

http://rc-network.de/forum/showthread.php?t=237889 "

Thanks MarkusD for link you provided but at this moment I am not looking to buy "RTF" heli because I have other projects to finish first.If I decide to go with TDR I am going to sign up on waiting list and at that way I`ll "buy" some time to finish other things and collect necessary equipment for TDR.

"If you want to test fly a TDR and you are sometimes in Germay, I suggest to book some flight in Bernd Poetings flight school ( www.poeting1.de ). He is located near cologne (approx. 1h drive) and teaches all year......"

That would be wonderful idea,I would like that.And because nature of my job I travel a lot,in next two month I should be in Germany for short period of time I could look about that school.Thanks for suggest.

Alex:
I have looked link you sent to me about Shape.Thanks.Like I said first time see that machine and I dont want to say anything,because I dont know,but one thing is sure.It cost more then any other heli kit (on there site 1249 Euro).Dont get me wrong,I am not saying it does not worth or anything bad,just wondering what is engineering,flying characteristics reason to cost more then Kasama Faifa,Avant,Mikado,Align?I would like to have whole picture before I make my opinion :-).

And Ingo`s point was simply about his own opinion which I was in generaly asked from members who have TDR.Thanks Ingo for sharing your experience,appreciate.

Have question about Scorpion 4525 520 LE.Is it going to be in sale again or they will make certain number and that is it?

Happy New Year

Regards

Davor

The LE motor is a limited run, now sure how many they will produce.

I suspect that similar type motors will be standard off the shelf units shortly as electrics are becoming more and more popular and the lipos can deliver!

The shape helicopter looks interesting but I doubt the price reflects flight quality, it is certainly the most exspensive heli.